Title: Rare and unusual aircraft | |
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majorshrapnel | |
Date Posted:2023-03-10 01:20:03Copy HTML The BritishTSR2. This superb, highly advanced strike and reconnaissance aircraft is known in aviation circles as the plane that was shot down by its own government, as it never saw service or action. It was and still is, surrounded by mystery, conspiracy and conjecture. It was given a remarkable specification at birth, all of which were achieved and more. For a start it had to gain flight in under 600 yards and reach Mach 1.1 at ground level (200ft max) and Mach 2.2 at medium to high altitude, carry a nuclear bomb to Russia, dogfight with the best and remember we are dealing with an aircraft conceived in the 50's. It would have both front and side seeking radar and its Bristol Siddeley engines would later be fitted to the Concorde but only after the TSR2 had sorted its many faults out.The British aircraft industry had come out of WW2 as one of the very best, innovative designers and builders and with a nuclear Soviet Union to tend to the west needed such a high specification aircraft. The problem with the industry though was that we had no war to feed it and with an almost bankrupt nation it had too many companies chasing too few contracts, which led to a poison atmosphere in the industry and its various manufacturers, all stoked by political favouritism. The answer was the amalgamation of them to form BAC the British Aircraft Corporation and it was this company that would build the TSR2, all be it around the country, which became its first fault. Before it had been laid fully out it suffered political interference and design tampering, all of which began to raise the time and cost of it. Eventually it took to the air and it was spectacular and no exaggeration to say it was the finest aircraft on earth. Unfortunately it had just too many enemies, both at home and abroad, most notably the US with its rival F111. At home there was Louis Mountbatten a devoted navy man who wanted money for the Royal Navy. The RAF had 126 aircraft on order and the first overseas order was 30 for Australia but then we sent its biggest enemy to Australia in Mountbatten who then did his best to scupper the deal. In 1964 the Labour govt under Wilson came to power and the new PM visited the US to meet Johnson, a President who had been putting pressure on the Aussies to cancel their order and buy the F111 at a rock bottom price, ie under cost and between them they had the order cancelled with no objection from Wilson, who was after US loans and feared they would scupper his plans to borrow money from the IMF. Attacked from both sides the project was suddenly cancelled but not only was it cancelled but the political order went out that all built airframes, machines and tooling was to be destroyed and it was, including a wooden mock up, so that there would be no chance of another change of mind. The only change of mind was that we then bought 50 F111's from the Yanks. The govt wouldn't even allow the manufacturers to keep one for research, not one, it had to go, lock, stock and barrel and were even used as target practice. However, two in various states of finish were kept aside and they do survive and are on show at RAF Duxford museum. |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #101 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-30 07:53:42Copy HTML |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #102 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-30 07:55:32Copy HTML |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #103 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-30 07:59:42Copy HTML |
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tommytalldog | Share to: #104 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-30 11:54:07Copy HTML Any of these photos taken around Pembroke, Pete? |
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tommytalldog | Share to: #105 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-30 01:51:02Copy HTML In 1962, U.S. Air Force pilot Brian Shul flew an SR71 Blackbird at an altitude of 80,000 feet & a speed of Mach 3.3 or 2193 mph. This made him the fastest man alive at the time. |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #106 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 03:32:35Copy HTML Any of these photos taken around Pembroke, Pete? No, the twin Huey is from 433 sqn and I was with 427 Sqn. The picture was taken in Cold lake along with some of the others pics . |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #107 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 03:34:34Copy HTML |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #108 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 03:47:17Copy HTML Known affectionately as the “Clunk” by its aircrews, or disparagingly as the heavy metal “Lead Sled” by F-86 pilots, the CF- 100 was the most effective all-weather fighter in the West’s inventory during the 1950s. (The "Clunk" nickname arose from the noise the front landing gear made as it retracted into its well after takeoff.) I worked on them in North Bay and a real pain trying to get the ejection seat in from first the wing then over the motor to finally the cock pit. They used gaseous oxygen for the crew still where the more modern A/C use liquid oxygen now. |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #109 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 04:17:44Copy HTML F-104 nicknamed the widow maker because if you got a flame out the wings weren't made to make you be able to glide. it was like riding in a rocket .It was still being use when I was in Germany. As a safety systems tech in Cold lake I got to talk to a few of the pilots that flew them in Germany. They were more picky about how their helmet, chute, G suits and oxygen masks fit while the younger pilots weren't. I got to talking to a couple of them and I found out why they looked after their safety equipment were the younger ones didn't. It was because they were both forced to bail out their planes in Germany and they found out the hard way that you have to make sure everything is worn tight. Both had bailed from flame outs from bird strikes while doing low level passed at the ranges. One of them had to bail out a second time do to some other A/C malfunction. Their helmets for example are built from scratch and are make to fit each pilot's head. Same for their oxygen masks Many times the helmet liner has to be custom make first also by my trade because no two head are the same. |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #110 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 04:23:26Copy HTML CF-101 Voodoo. Cold Lake.
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MarkUK | Share to: #111 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 08:02:52Copy HTML Why were you as a tankie messing around with such technical things as aircraft? You're playing chess with Fate and Fate's winning.
Arnold Bennett
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #112 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 08:22:14Copy HTML CF-116 Freedom Fighter like I worked on in Cold Lake. I was on them from 1984 -89. They were retired in 1985 and replaced by F-18's Notice the pipe sticking up coming out on the front right side. That is for air to air refueling and to refuel them we used Boeing 707. We flew to Germany from Cold lake and air refueled 4 of them across the Atlantic. We first stopped in Happy Valley Goose Bay Labrador before crossing over. |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #113 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 08:45:36Copy HTML Here we are crossing and at one stag one of the pilots somehow stood up in the small cockpit and pulled down his flight suit and mooned us all in the 707.Flying over Greenland. if you look close at the last picture down you will see that the numbers on the planes are backward. I used side film to take these shots and when I converted them to normal pictures I put the side in backward in the copier. No windows does support my slide copier anymore an d have to by another computer with Windows 11 and another slide copier but in no rush to spend the couple of thousand dollars it would cost me. I guess I could use my slide projector and copy the pictures off the large screen or a white wall. |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #114 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 08:48:48Copy HTML |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #115 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 08:51:27Copy HTML Here's the one where the planes seem to be going the wrong way. |
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tommytalldog | Share to: #116 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-08-31 11:24:20Copy HTML CF-101 Voodoo. Cold Lake.
The McDonnell F-101 Voodoo was the first rate interceptor in the 1950's. It set a world record for speed & my cousin worked on them at the US air force base at Great Falls Montana. The Voodoo was replaced by the legendary F-4 Phantom & there is one of those on static display at our local American Legion. |
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tommytalldog | Share to: #117 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-09-01 02:10:21Copy HTML Pete, the CF prefix=Canadian Forces? |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #118 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-09-02 12:32:45Copy HTML Why were you as a tankie messing around with such technical things as aircraft? Because when I was posted to an Armoured Recce Regiment after Europe I missed the tanks so much that after a few years I traded trades and become Airforce as a Life Support Tech which are also referred to as Last Change Techs because we are the ones you have to reply on encase you have to bail out of your Jet, have to stop it on a runway when the brakes can't do it, or escape from a burning passenger plane on the ground or get suck in a land or seas survival situation to survive. No matter what I did Mark I never forgot the tanks. We still did a lot of travelled in the Airforce though. To Norway twice, to Germany again, to train twice in Kentucky/ Tennessee at Fort Campbell with the 101 Air Assault (helicopters) And down to Arizona twice with the jets training in Yuma and then in Phoenix. I joined the military to see the world and got to do it on their buck and a military ID card. I still have never had a passport but there is so much to see in this Country still, I don't need one. One of the more scary things I have done and didn't like was getting stuck sitting in the cock pit of a F-116 Freedom Fighter doing a run up. That's when you are testing the engines to the point you think you will never hear again and thinking all the time what's it going to be like is these chalk chains break that are the only things holding the plane from trying to take off and I end up going through the maintenance shack directly in front of me at a 100 miles an hour. I was wondering all the time, now who's going to pay for that mess. I hope it won't be me. |
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pbandrew3rd | Share to: #119 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-09-02 12:33:54Copy HTML Pete, the CF prefix=Canadian Forces? Yup |
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majorshrapnel | Share to: #120 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-10-01 01:53:00Copy HTML You've heard of the Mosquito but have you ever heard of the Moskito? Herman the German, or Goering if you like, went green with envy at the exploits of the De Havilland Mosquito and said so, adding that 'the British build a wooden plane that every piano factory in the land can build.' Not quite but skills in fields not usually connected to the aircraft industry could now play their part in the building of this extraordinary craft, the most versatile aircraft of the war. Herman the German decided he must have his own and Focke Wolf built him one in 1943, which the imaginative name of the Moskito. It was not all wood, it also comprised steel and aluminium too, also its engines were not up to the standard of the Merlin and alarmingly during its testing bits of the aircraft were prone to escape when the guns we're fired, why? Because our glue was better than their glue.To add to that a weak landing gear and faulty hydraulics resulted in a number of crashes. By the time they got to 1944 they were on their eighth version, which killed its test pilot and then, in what must be rated as one of the most ironic tales of the war the RAF sent a squadron of real Mosquitoes to flatten the factory. At the end of the war the Yanks took one home for evaluation, which unfortunately disappeared but apparently we have one which is in the British airforce museum. |
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tommytalldog | Share to: #121 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-10-01 01:55:02Copy HTML Never heard of it, Major. I thought the Japs were the world's copycats at that time. |
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majorshrapnel | Share to: #122 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-10-02 08:10:58Copy HTML Never heard of it, Major. I thought the Japs were the world's copycats at that time. It was shamelessly after the war they stole everybody's designs and ideas, just like the Chinese are doing right now. The Japanese government gave its motorcycle industry thirty years to destroy the British motorcycle industry and the subsidies to achieve it. It only took less than half that time and a combination of arrogant, useless, greedy directors and an apathetic government allowed them to. |
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majorshrapnel | Share to: #123 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-10-04 09:05:47Copy HTML In an ironic twist, the Japs are now complaing to the Chinese for stealing their designs and ideas. What goes around comes around eh? After the war part of the Jap steel industry was based in Sheffield, no, not that Sheffield in Britain, home of steel but Sheffield Japan, that way they could make steel and put on the label Made in Sheffield. They also had a manufacturing town called USA. Back in the 60's and 70's we had a fiery political TV presenter and interviewer called Robin Day, who took the opportunity to confront the Japanese ambassador to Britain when he decided to appear before the TV cameras. He pulled out an article made in Japan which was an exact copy of one invented and made in Britain. After spluttering for a moment he called Robin Day treacherous. Day replied....treacherous you say? Well Pearl Harbour to you! |
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majorshrapnel | Share to: #124 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-10-04 10:30:44Copy HTML I saw on the TV this morning an add for a commemorative medal to mark the 80th anniversary of the Dambuster's Raid. Not quite got their day right, as it was actually carried out on the 16th May but yes, it was 80 years ago and this seemingly impossible strike at the very heart of German war production by bouncing a five ton bomb across water before settling it up against the dam wall exactly 30 ft underwater before exploding would have been impossible without the most successful bomber of the war, the AVRO Lancaster, which was the only aircraft capable of doing it. This aircraft, with a face only a bomber crew could love, was a major factor in the defeat of fascism and would have ended the war in Europe very much sooner had the psychopathic, death cultist maniac, Hitler, not been in charge, such was its impact on German cities and the population. Bomber command would lose over 56,000 crewmen in the war and Germany over 350,000 civilians alone, not to mention the destruction of their major cities and war production. Like the Mosquito, the Lancaster before it had its enemies, none more so than Max Aitkin, or Lord Beaverbrook as he was, minister of production. He owned Express newspapers and he couldn't see further than the already in service Manchester bomber, a flying death trap which its crews feared and hated in equal measure. The Manchester was also built by AVRO and was a two engined bomber. The airframe was great but the engines were dodgy to say the least and they were Rolls Royce engines too. They were the unreliable Vulture engine, which had many faults and was hopelessly unreliable. The jewel in the crown of aircraft engines, the Merlin engine, was only designated to fighter planes at the time. Following many deaths at the hands of the Manchester the top man at AVRO approached Beaverbrook with his idea for a four engines bomber but wanted the Merlin. Beaverbrook turned him down flat, unless he paid for it himself and told him to get on producing the Manchester, as thousands had already been ordered. However, Chadwick of AVRO, just like Geoffrey DeHavilland with the Mosquito, went ahead with his ideas and bollocks to Beaverbrook. The thing was, the Lanc was basically a Manchester on steroids, so 70% of it was the same which means you save years and a fortune producing the vital machine tools to build it, they were already there. This was a stroke of genius but without the Merlin it was dead in the water and Beaverbrook wouldn't shift, so Rolls Royce sneaked him four engines out of the back door to play with. Coupled to the brilliant Manchester airframe, enlarged and extended to carry the four engines, the Lanc was born. When it came to its maiden flight at Ringway airport Manchester its two crew members looked like men going up to the gallows, such was the reputation of the Manchester, if two engines were a death-trap, what would four be? They took off and were so delighted with it they stayed up for double the time designated and really took it through its paces, a star was born. They would go on to build around 7000 and the factory they built them in was as innovative as the plane itself. It was built at Yeadon in Yorkshire in a custom made factory. All factories were vulnerable to bombing and everybody knew this would be a prize target for the Luftwaffe so they decided to make it invisible. They brought in designers from the film industry and the factory was totally covered over with earth and planted with trees, grass and complete with fences and fake cows grazing. No shadows were allowed to be cast and no German ever dropped a bomb on it, it was invisible. |
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tommytalldog | Share to: #125 |
Re:Rare and unusual aircraft Date Posted:2023-10-04 11:27:58Copy HTML In an ironic twist, the Japs are now complaing to the Chinese for stealing their designs and ideas. What goes around comes around eh? After the war part of the Jap steel industry was based in Sheffield, no, not that Sheffield in Britain, home of steel but Sheffield Japan, that way they could make steel and put on the label Made in Sheffield. They also had a manufacturing town called USA. Back in the 60's and 70's we had a fiery political TV presenter and interviewer called Robin Day, who took the opportunity to confront the Japanese ambassador to Britain when he decided to appear before the TV cameras. He pulled out an article made in Japan which was an exact copy of one invented and made in Britain. After spluttering for a moment he called Robin Day treacherous. Day replied....treacherous you say? Well Pearl Harbour to you! Another ironic twist is in the 50's most Jap products were junk, even into the mid-60's. Then came some sort of revolution & everybody wanted Jap quality............in electronics, cars, motorcycles. Seems to me that China is on the cusp of change now. BTW, I do remember the USA Jap products, but never knew they had a Sheffield too. I have some Sheffield knives for years & now I find out they may be Jap? |